Some of you may have noticed I've been largely absent from the blogiverse and twitterdom for roughly the past couple of weeks. Between guests coming to stay with us, followed by a family trip to the East Coast, I've been living mainly in the real world... (which apparently entails being buried under a shitload of laundry and having to speak my thoughts -- after running them through my newly installed internal filter of "will I ruin everybody's day and/or make someone cry if I say this" -- rather than type them. bizarre.) while allowing (as if I could help it -- please.) potential post after post to compose themselves in my mind like some endless stream-of-consciousness monologue. So weird to think that, during many of my daily interactions with actual human beings, I was jotting down mental post-it notes for things that may or may not one day make it to this blog.
However, despite all the time that has passed, this whole forgiveness thing continues to weigh heavily on my mind and heart and has preoccupied a lot of my internal energy. I might've been able to move past it, were it not for the thoughtful and thought-provoking comments I received after publishing those last two posts where I more or less (okay, more) ranted about how done I am with the idea of forgiveness, how I've come to see it as a form of enabling perpetual wrongs, a form of permission, rather than the graceful, virtuous ideal it's historically been treated as.
I have all these ideas racing through my head (more like battling it out and beating the crap out of each other), but they aren't coherent yet. And as I struggle to make sense of why many of my readers seemingly have come to similar conclusions about what I see as essentially the injustice implied by the act of forgiving (ie -- how unfair it is to the one doing the forgiving), among other equally intriguing perspectives, I thought what I'd do was publish some of the comments I received that got me feeling like I had at least one more post in me on this same subject, or at least that this topic demanded further consideration.
I have found that, when I've had the time to read them, comments on the blogs of others have often been at least as interesting as the posts which inspired those comments in the first place. And as I'm sure many of you don't often have the time to read the comments left at my blog, I thought this particular set of responses were worth sharing, especially as they've inspired me to the further exploration of which I've just spoken. Hopefully, when I finally do publish that subsequent post, it will delve a little further and deeper than the previous ones, shedding new light (okay, darkness, because let's face it... this is me we're talking about) or at least be semi/pseudo/quasi-insightful.
(And also, in the interest of candor, I have sworn to myself that I will WORK ON MY DAMN SCREENPLAY IF IT KILLS ME, as I am trying so desperately to achieve that balance as a writer which I ranted about here a while back... But damn, this self-imposed non-blogging is fucking hard! I need to draw up a schedule or something that shows which days/hours/nano-seconds/psychic energies should be devoted to screenwriting and which ones to posting and which ones to commenting and which ones to... life. Sigh. Fucking ridiculous. And I know you all know what I'm talking about. This is about the point in time when I have to chant my bitch-slap of a mantra, which some of you may recall from my earlier post, though I sometimes adapt it as needed):
BRING ON THE BLOG-ANON.
God grant me the self-control
to stop blogging (and commenting) all the fucking time;
to accept that sometimes I have other shit -- important shit -- that I should do,
am relied-upon to do,
used to WANT to do;
(and STILL want to do, like screenwriting)
and NEED to do;
(again, like screenwriting, which, lest we forget, USED TO PAY MY FUCKING BILLS... which is actually somewhat helpful, especially if you want to renovate your new fucking house because you've just recently moved to the midfuckingwest)
courage to get back to all that other shit that USED TO BE MY LIFE;
and wisdom to know how lucky I am
(and that I can only expect just so much tolerance from my
truly wonderful family and friends)
(not to mention my "people" in Los Angeles, who are on the verge of declaring my so-called, increasingly former, career as a writer and director DOA, or at least MIA).
@Amen
What follows are some of those insightful, thoughtful comments which have inspired me to do a follow-up to my last two posts. As those comments were public, I hope those of you whose quotes I've used don't mind that I've attributed them to you here as well. In some cases, for relevancy and brevity, I took the liberty of using excerpts. I've also chosen some quotes from QuoteWorld.org and, in no particular order, put those into the mix for your perusal and possible contemplation.
Without further ado.... some thoughts on forgiveness (or the lack thereof):
hmmm....this is a thinker, and I likes me a good think. Of course, I can't speak for what you've gone through, because there could well be some unforgivable stuff, and a person who is never going to change, will indeed exhaust the finite supply of forgiveness. As far as forgiving someone is concerned, the greatest hope lies in the notion that that person will actually realize what an asshole they were, and legitimately regret it. I've often found that the people who are true douches never actually say sorry ever anyway.
"Forgive your enemies, but never forget their names."
- John Fitzgerald Kennedy
Well, I have spent an eternity reading about how forgiving frees you, etc. Well, that may be true, but in the end, I feel it invalidates my suffering. So, I've decided, that for my mental health? I can remain pissed.
"Forgiveness breaks the chain of causality because he who forgives you -- out of love--takes upon himself the consequences of what you have done. Forgiveness, therefore, always entails a sacrifice."
- Dag Hjalmar Agné Carl Hammarskjold
"We must develop and maintain the capacity to forgive. He who is devoid of the power to forgive is devoid of the power to love. There is some good in the worst of us and some evil in the best of us."
- Martin Luther King, Jr.
It takes me a really really long time to forgive. But when I finally do? It's never about the other person. It's about me being ready to let go of the anger and hurt. HOWEVER, that being said? I'm a HUGE believer in exacting my revenge in a vigilante justice sort of way. I like to do this FIRST. The forgiveness can come later.
"It's far easier to forgive an enemy after you've got even with him."
- Olin Miller
"Forgiveness is not an occasional act: it is an attitude."
- Martin Luther King, Jr.
Some things can never be forgiven. 'Nuff said.
"To forgive is human. To forget, divine."
- James Grand
"If there is something to pardon in everything, there is also something to condemn."
- Friedrich Nietzsche
I don't know--since my Mom died last year, I just don't get all bunged up about a lot of stuff anymore. This is not to say I don't get pissed over stupid fuckwits, but I let a hell of a lot of it go. A lot of people--hell, most of them are insensitive and completely self-serving and self absorbed. I accept to a greater extent that this is just the way it be's sometimes and I move on from these people. I used to get pretty fucking angry, and it that anger would fester and last for AGES. Then someone I loved so, so much died horribly and frighteningly and painfully, and damn I might sound like a hallmark card, but nothing else seems quite so inconsequential any longer. Life is too precarious.
"Forgiveness is the answer to the child's dream of a miracle by which what is broken is made whole again, what is soiled is again made clean."
- Dag Hjalmar Agné Carl Hammarskjold
BUT...it can be a whole different ballgame with FAMILY, because it's not like you can divorce or break up with some of those assholes.
"It is easier to forgive an enemy than to forgive a friend."
- William Blake
"We read that we ought to forgive our enemies; but we do not read that we
ought to forgive our friends."
- Sir Francis Bacon
I am so fucken glad you wrote this today. I am not in a particularly forgiving mood. I'm in a pissed off one. My zen has vanished for the day and it makes me want to punch someone's lights out. I DO believe that, sometimes, violence IS the answer. You made a very good point in explaining that "understanding" is more helpful than forgiveness. Does someone's forgiveness actually make YOU feel any better? Does it give you permission to excuse your own behavior? No. You have to either forgive yourself or not to move forward and/or make changes that lead you to the behavior. I looked up the definition of forgiveness, due to my own struggle, and it says it is to let go of the claim for retribution. THAT I can do. To imply I will not be affected by someone's behavior, or maltreatment because I SAY I will not is another story. I won't forget. It has forever changed my impression and therefore, how I respond in my relationship. I am not "okay" with things. I am merely tolerating them in order to move forward. And that has clearly defined boundaries. You can give a second chance, but to avoid being a doormat, take away the power for them to "get your goat" again.
"Forgiveness means letting go of the past."
- Gerald Jampolsky
It comes to a point where forgiveness is moot. I started many years ago deleting people from my mind, life and thoughts. They just didn't 'exist' for me anymore. Even were I to run into them somewhere, I have the uncanny ability to overlook their presence. I had someone question me about it once, and I flat out told them "You don't exist in my life anymore and I feel better for it. Have a nice day."It fucks people up a bit, but it sure feels good not to care!! They get no more energy from me. I did the same with my own father for about 3 years. I think he drank himself silly. I've since let him back into my life and he has sobered up, but he also is the same person with his same asshole tendencies as ever. I've also told him that I shut him out once, and I will again if I need to. So he behaves. Don't turn the other cheek. Delete those fuckers!!!
"The incomparable stupidity of life teaches us to love our parents; divine philosophy teaches us to forgive them."
- Baron de la Brede et de Montesquieu
"The first thing was, I learned to forgive myself. Then, I told myself, 'Go ahead and do whatever you want, it's okay by me.'"
- Jack Handey [Deep Thoughts]
Summersaid...
What Leanne said. I'm a cutter offer. For me, the words 'I'm sorry' are empty; action matter. Words not so much. I don't even know what forgiveness really is- I'm a linear, pragmatic person, and forgiveness is a concept, not an action. Forgiveness is an act of will, in the mind. I can't will myself to feel a certain way. We're either OK or we're not. We're cool or we're not. If you fuck me over or hurt my kids, we're not cool. If you hurt my kids, I'll hurt you back, then delete you from my world. I've been known to utter the words "I forgive you" as a kindness to someone else, in total contradiction to my actual feelings of rage, because the right thing to do was to let them feel like the issue was resolved before I removed them from my life completely. But yes, it would be harmful for you and the people around you for you to keep allowing hurtful people to continue doing hurtful things. Forgiveness? It's an abstract idea. Removing the threat is a concrete action.
"Never does the human soul appear so strong and noble as when it forgoes revenge and dares to forgive injury."
- Edwin Hubbel Chapin
oh, and there's something to being able to just shrug the shoulders and say "I no longer give a shit," which is not the same as "I forgive you." It's a whole different plateau of "your bullshit can no longer touch me," but without all the rage and regret that comes with trying to forgive.
"There is no revenge so complete as forgiveness."
- Josh Billings
big sigh....forgiveness has so many different levels I think. Frankly I wish I had more of it for myself (that sounds selfish) I think about things I've done when I was six and mean to someone else and I feel so anxious about it....I wish I had forgiveness for myself at times like that... I wish that people didn't give me such a hard time for not having enough forgiveness for when I was wronged. I feel like I was taught to be someone else's verbal punching bag, to be okay with being manipulated and teased (and not in a fun way)...I hated that my reaction to someone else's meanness was in question and not their meanness...now that's a little f'd up. I finally cut this person out of my life...unfortunately she lives in the same neighborhood and I see her every so often..but I'm okay with that. Amazingly, I have not forgiven her and I am not angry about it, I feel stronger for it and surprisingly I have opened myself up to lovely people who have become wonderful friends -- unlike this other person who pretty much convinced me I was unlikeable --- that's another thing I wish I could forgive myself for...letting her dictate so much of how I lived my life...and being such a time-suck. so - in short forgive yourself = good forgiving others = more crap and the sanctimonious christian thing...OMG -- I am a christian, although no one would know it because I'm soooo flawed --- but there are times when I am at church and I want to mess up some perfect hair and say, 'really, really? are you really that goooood? because I don't think so' -- mostly i want to mess up the perfect hair, because it doesn't matter what I do to mine, it's going to what it wants to...so maybe I'm envious...see I am a really bad christian.
"The idea of God is the sole wrong for which I cannot forgive mankind."
- Marquis de Sade
"Forgive many things in others; nothing in yourself."
- Ausonius
I fucking luv your ass..well not yer ass perse, but just your blatant way..it's the only way I understand. You see, this is where blog therapy, in lieu of talk therapy can be cathartic in unpacking years of accumulated resentments, even if for the moment. As I read your regurgitation of emotions...anxiety, anger, contempt, stress, guilt, shame, grief, disgust, frustration, your dogma on forgiveness, and how seemingly useless it can be, it reminds me of how vulnerable we really are-- that there are obvious limits to our human psyche when we are so deeply hurt or wronged repeatedly. We become numb to the pain, to all the shit we've had to bear, and inevitably are forced to our breaking point.
"To understand is to forgive, even oneself."
- Alexander Chase
OH YEAH---it also just occurred to me that I could NEVER forgive the specialist who treated my Mom for weeks and never ever saw her stage IV lung cancer. Hrm... scratch most of that other zen-ish stuff I said.
"To know all is not to forgive all. It is to despise everybody."
- Quentin Crisp
Just remember, there's NOTHING like a good hate so keep it up!!!
